WHILE THE WORD CONVERGENCE is still a four-letter word to some, Rogers Media president Tony Viner sits on the axis of convergence in the Rogers Empire.
His division, which includes the Toronto Blue Jays, radio, magazines, TV and other media is a large supplier of content to the company’s other two huge divisions: cable and wireless. While all at NAB this week fret about producing for multiple platforms, hitting all the screens has been in the Rogers plan for some time, with the media division providing the content. 
Rogers Media president Tony Viner (left) recently chatted with cartt.ca editor and publisher Greg O’Brien on his division’s view of the present challenges and future opportunities. What follows is an edited transcript.
Greg O’Brien: How are you?
Tony Viner: Terrific, thanks. Well, not really, (the Blue Jays) are three-and-four. All that money I spent…
GOB: Oh, that’s right. All those bums you brought in?
TV: Exactly.
GOB: Are they allowed to talk like that on The FAN?
TV: I can never control the people on there – try as I might. In fact, McCown very frequently calls me an empty suit on the air.
GOB: Does he ever get you on the air?
TV: I’ve been on the air with Bob a couple of times.
GOB: What are the ratings like on (Prime Time Sports with Bob McCown on Sportsnet)?
TV: You know, they’re very good. You’ve got to think of what we would be running in its place and yes, it does quite well. It’s not a Toronto Maple Leaf hockey game… but it does fine. The ratings are quite good but we do it as really a cross-platform promotion as much as anything else. Where it’s terrifically helpful in our view is in the radio ratings because it promotes Bob as a personality and makes him top of mind.
GOB: Yes, but – you probably even might agree with this – it’s not the most compelling video in the world.
TV: Not the most compelling, I guess that is a fair statement. We like to think of it as television verité. Many people like it though because it’s a real view of a radio studio.
GOB: So, when is Bob going to be high definition?
TV: That’s a very good question. We have to put high def cameras here in the radio studio. So, it’ll happen when we’re 100% high def, but we’re pretty well large screen on Sportsnet the whole time now. And then we’re high def whenever we can be, especially on the live events.
GOB: That was my first question for you. Where is Rogers Media right now in terms of high definition? I mean I know Sportsnet is pretty well advanced, but I’m curious to see where the OMNI channels or even The Shopping Channel might be.
TV: The plans for both are to be high def as quickly as we can. Both are all-digital at the studio (and) we are in the process of installing our digital transmitters because we have our licenses from the CRTC for OMNI (in Toronto, not in BC or Winnipeg) and we’ll be proceeding with the installation of those transmitters.
We also think that it will be important for The Shopping Channel to be in high def. We think one of the ways in which we can defend ourselves, if that’s the right word, against the onslaught of other, alternative distribution technologies is to have the best picture. And we think that given the choice people will watch a high definition picture instead of watching something on their wireless device or even watching it even on their computer. So, we think it’s crucial for broadcasters to invest in high def technology.
GOB: Speaking of your mobile service, will we be able to shop with our cell phones?
TV: Yes, that’s in the plan. I’m not 100% sure when you’ll actually be able to do it, but you can now access it on the web. The shopping channel’s web commerce – you know, there should be safe harbor language around this, (was) $60 million last year and we think it’ll approach 80 this year.
We’re one of Canada’s leading e-commerce sites. And, you know, if you’re cell phone is properly equipped, then you can access us from your cell phone. But we’ll be working with all wireless suppliers to begin to bring alerts and today’s "showstoppers" to your cell phone, if you should wish it, so that you’ll be able to know at least what the special of the day is.
GOB: I was surprised recently to have pointed out to me what’s available for sale on The Shopping Channel. It’s not just the exercise machines and jewelry. There’s laptop computers and all sorts of things on there now.
TV: On a recent weekend we did almost $4 million worth of sales on Dell computers. We sell televisions, electronics, fashion, health and beauty and jewelry and exercise equipment as well as housewares.
GOB: I guess I was stuck in the original mode of shopping on TV where it was all “cheesy merchandise”. But it’s moved into legitimate, certainly branded stuff.
TV: You’re absolutely right. There’s a varied offering of high quality merchandise and still, you know, some unique product that is on the air.
But (TSC is) growing very, very rapidly. I think today we talked about Wal-Mart being up sort of 1.3% in sales in the quarter and we were up nine… it’s a business that I’m thrilled that we’re involved with.
GOB: Let’s switch it up a little bit to the radio side of Rogers Media. Let’s talk about the ratings since they were out yesterday. Were you happy with the performance overall?
TV: Whooo hoo!. You probably wanted a better answer than that though, Greg. Yes, it was one of the best ratings we’ve ever had. We were especially proud of the performance turned in by CHFI, which, we had a 10-share, then had a 6-share, and now it’s got a 10-share again.
Bringing Erin Davis and Mike Cooper back to the mornings has paid off – they’re number one in the mornings. And you know I’m just so proud of the group that did that because it required eating a little crow.
GOB: Yup. Had to go back to her after letting her go.
TV: That’s right and I think there are lots of companies who, even if they thought it was the right thing to do would not have wished to publicly acknowledge that they’d made a mistake – and I’m complicit in that as any of the others.
GOB: Now, what about beyond Toronto. Were you happy with the performance of the new eastern stations?
TV: The Maritimes met expectations is what I’m going to say. We just launched them, it’s all news on FM, so it’s not something that the market is used to.
(All-news) was a very slow build in Toronto, a very slow build in Vancouver. But, long term, these all-news services provide rock solid ratings and rock solid revenues and are a real community service for the markets in which they find themselves. And one of the advantages of Rogers is that its always had the long-term view.
We have recently switched our Calgary AM station to all news just about a week ago. So, we’ve got some strong stations throughout the country. But all news is a slow build. Big investment, long term investment, but a very solid one.
GOB: But when it pays off, like 680 News has, you’ve got a pretty valuable demographic listening as well.
TV: It’s phenomenal. I mean, 680 News is the highest billing AM station in Canada – and it’s comfortably profitable. And CKWX 1130 News in Vancouver took a long time to become profitable. It didn’t break even maybe the year before last, and then last year it made a profit, and this year it’s going to make an even bigger one. But frankly, if you ask broadcasters, radio broadcasters around the country, how many of their AM stations make money at all – you can count them on the fingers of one hand.
GOB: That’s for sure. Now, what do you think the ratings reveal about the Jack format? Is it kind of running out of steam now?
TV: It’s never had as much steam as we had hoped in Toronto, and I can’t lie to you, the competition is stiff in Toronto. But, we’re number one in Calgary and number one in Vancouver against our target of adults 25-54. So, while we’re not ahead by 10-share points, I think we’ve settled down to a defensible position in the market. And since that position’s number one against the target market, we’re pretty happy with it.
If you look at, when we first launched it, there was a novelty factor, but, if you compare where we are today, for example, to where we were with the old KISS format in Vancouver, we’re considerably stronger and we’re very happy with where we are.
GOB: Any plans for Jack in Toronto? Any changes or anything like that?
TV: Yes, but if I told you what they were, I’d have to kill you, Greg.
GOB: All right. Let’s talk about how – on radio and TV – you’re facing a lot of disruptive technologies: satellite radio, streaming free video and audio, things like the Slingbox. What’s your feeling on those? Are they a hindrance or is it more opportunity?
TV: We have to do two things. We have to make sure we have a defensive strategy and an offensive strategy. First, we’re trying to enhance the intrinsic strengths of each of the media; whether it be magazines with their unparalleled ability to have beautiful reproduction, attractive ads and attractive artwork; or radio with personalities like Bob McCown or Erin Davis and Mike Cooper and with local service. So, we’re trying to enhance with the strengths of the various media are. But at the same time, we are aggressively pursuing what we call unregulated media, which is mostly the web, but will include wireless devices.
Some of it will be a companion to the media that we already have and we’ll be able to use the significant promotional power that they provide. But some of it’s just going to be just on the web, or just in a different environment. We intend to do both of those things.
GOB: Overall, do you see a growing media pie or are there going to be more smaller slices that you’re going to have to target?
TV: I think the media pie will grow, and we’ll each have to satisfy ourselves with smaller slices of it because although the media pie will grow, there’ll be more and more competitors for the money. We’re going to have to work harder, but we’ve always been in competitive markets and we’re prepared for it. It’ll make us better broadcasters, better publishers and better retailers. So, I’m not panicked about it and I’m not even concerned about it, but we are aware of it and we think we can take advantage of it.
GOB: So, how far away am I from getting the Blue Jays’ games live, so that I can watch them on my Blackberry, wherever I am?
TV: You can get it now if you’ve got the proper device (but not on Blackberry). On a phone, you can… we have a deal with Mobi TV to stream some games where you can watch the whole game (the Jays were the first MLB team to do this – via a Sportsnet stream).
Here’s how we think about that, though: It’s supplementary viewing.
I describe it as my wife’s cousin’s wedding. So, you’re at you’re wife’s cousin’s wedding. You don’t really want to go, but you’re there because it’s you’re wife’s cousin’s wedding but you want to watch the game. So then you’ll watch it on your cell phone. But my guess is that given your druthers, you’d just as soon watch it on your television. But I don’t think the future on those small devices is streaming. I think the future will be clips, mobisodes, so-called mobisode alerts where if somebody would send me an e-mail every time the Leafs scored and what the score is, that would be neat.
GOB: And maybe a replay of the goal.
TV: I’d love to see a replay of the goal. Now, there are rights issues and other things but that’s exactly what you’d like to see.
GOB: I was at a session at the National Cable Show where they had 10 Georgia Tech students to talk about their media consumption. Somebody asked the question, would they be willing to sit, even a screen as big as a Playstation portable, and watch a two hour movie on it. And the answer for all of them was no. And the main reason was because they can’t really gather their friends around to watch this little tiny thing. And they were more interested in short, you know, funny clips kind of thing that they can share.
TV: And I agree with that. I think that’s the future of that medium. But it’s all supplementary. This gives people an opportunity to view when they wouldn’t have a chance to view. So, I think it adds to the viewing, not detracts from it.
GOB: Keeping with the wireless division, do you see any brand-extensions into that type of thing where you have a McLean’s TV news hit sent to cell phones or a Flair TV fashion hit sent to your wireless? Anything along those lines?
TV: Absolutely. It’s all part of our plan for 2006-07. We’re in development for all of those services right now.
GOB: I just got a Slingbox the other day. And I was able to watch Sportsnet live from my hotel room in Atlanta and Sling has a downloadable mobile version now so you can watch it on your Treo or whatever wireless. It’s pretty interesting.
TV: It really is and you know the challenge for us all will be trying to work with these new technologies and make sure that we take advantage of them. But, we have to embrace them. I’m concerned that some broadcasters are… at the shore trying to hold the waves back. You know you have to do it.
My theory, right or wrong, is that I was thrilled that you’re watching Sportsnet in Atlanta, because if you’re in Atlanta you wouldn’t be able to watch us.
GOB: But, now what if somebody from Atlanta is watching nothing but ESPN when they come to Toronto?
TV: I’d rather have you watch it in Atlanta.
Look, absolutely there are tradeoffs, you know, no question. But, you know, I’d rather have you be able to access our service
GOB: Now, what might you and Rogers have to say about all of this when it comes time for the coming TV policy review?
TV: Good question, because you know of course we just found out that it’s going to be coming soon. I don’t know if we’ve properly gathered our thoughts on this. I really don’t know where to begin.
There are lots of challenges out there and I don’t know if all can be met by the Regulator. I think the challenge has to be met by the entrepreneurs and business people and broadcasters acting on their own. I think it’s fine that the regulator is doing the review but at the end of the day, I don’t think we can look to them to provide solutions.
It’s not that they don’t mean well, they do, but I think we have to figure out, where we are in this competitive environment and how do we best take advantage of it. How do we invest properly and how do we take advantage of what’s available to us?
Going to the Regulator to say, “I wish things were better,” or “I wish things were different,” or “I wish it was like the olden days,”… I don’t know how that can help us and I don’t mean to be critical of anybody, I’m just saying I haven’t figured that out yet.
GOB: Even with the radio review and some of the submissions there, it’s a similar sort of look. I mean the issues are a little bit different but…
TV: In the radio review we said, "look don’t regulate us just because you can. Be aware that in our environment that we need to invest and we can’t tie one arm behind our back."
We have all of these outside forces – and I guess you would say exactly the same thing in TV – and you don’t layer on additional regulatory obligations when we’re competing now with unregulated media who are getting stronger. They’re not niche players anymore, they’re big players. And every single day we’re dealing with these challenges.
GOB: Were you surprised to see ABC freely steam, not in Canada of course, but freely stream some of their shows on the Internet?
TV: No, I don’t think so. I mean I thought it was very interesting that that was Disney’s decision… and good for them. (On-line, the ads can’t be skipped, so) it beats the heck out of a PVR. The PVR is what broadcasters should fear.
